Interview: Odette Filloux

Interview with Odette Filloux (b. 1929) about growing up in Oran, Algeria

The interview is in French, translated by Catherine Filloux.

CATHERINE FILLOUX: What was your parents’ profession?

ODETTE FILLOUX: I have always heard that my father was an employee at the lowest level, of the winery Maison Savignon, which was one of the large wine houses in Algeria. And he did not want to continue his studies after high school. And despite his father who asked him to, he wanted to go to work right away. So, he immediately got involved in this winery and since he was a serious and intelligent boy, he moved up the ladder more or less regularly. As to my mother she had taken the exam for L’Ecole Normale (Teachers College) and she passed, I believe I understood, at the written portion but not the oral portion, so for that reason she could not teach in the schools, which is what she most desired. She had been very disappointed so therefore she became a secretary. I don’t know if it was at the beginning of their marriage but rather quickly, in the army, she was the secretary of an officer in the colonial army. That’s what I know of them.

CF: And did Papilou (Odette’s father) change positions in your childhood?

OF: As I mentioned he progressed one could say and he learned many things, he no doubt started out running errands and he learned how to analyze the wines, he learned to harvest the grapes, he was a bit of a “man of all trades” – he learned a little everywhere. He was an elegant man, pleasant, open, and interested in things, so he progressed quite fast in his work. He went to work from his home, at first from the house where my grandmother lived, in the neighborhood where we stayed all our lives, but we changed apartments gradually based on my parents’ possibility, torent something better. He went from that house to his work by bicycle. And I would see him, later when I was older and I could understand and better see, I saw him leave in the morning, with his pants legs arranged so that they wouldn’t get in the wheels of the bicycle. With special things you put around the pants so they wouldn’t be too wide.

CF: Where did you visit as a child?... Where did you go in the area?

OF: Oh, we went…in my young childhood--I don’t remember traveling a lot in Algeria--we went on vacation rather in France, because it was said one had to restore one’s health, because it was thought that Algeria’s climate wasn’t always good for children, so we went to France in the mountains, because it was good to breathe the air of the mountains and that would help us in our lives. We went for example in the Pyrenees. One year we went to Manière de Bigor. And, in general, we did these trips with the brother of my father, René Piovanacci and his wife, and my cousin Suzette. We went sometimes -- it is true -- the brother of my father lived in Mascara inland – Oran being a port in the Mediterranean – and Mascara being in the mountains. We went to visit my father’s brother and I have very, very pleasant memories of these visits because we played prodigiously with my cousin Suzette with all sorts of very funny things, of which we have great memories. That is also where I heard the first time, which I remember, because I must have been very young, some discussions of a philosophical genre between my uncle who was a college professor in Mascara and his director whom he had invited to pass an afternoon -- for lunch, I don’t know. And after the lunch, or during the lunch, they discussed this notion that was much discussed of “spontaneous generation.” My uncle felt that it was ridiculous to believe in “spontaneous generation,” which he was right to think, but his director, he believed in it. So, I heard them discuss the truth of this notion of “spontaneous generation”, which was a theory at the time about which we discussed a lot. It interested and impressed me a lot that my uncle had a totally different idea than his director to whom he owed obedience, if one might say.

CF: And the beach?

OF: So, at the beach, we went…because my grandmother Boillat -- who was the mother of my mother, my Maman – [my grandmother] poor thing had a life that was somewhat disjointed, in the sense that she lived sometimes at my parents, sometimes at her son, Marcel’s, sometimes at her son, Emile’s. And that depended not on her, generally, but on the children themselves who decided, when and how and where, she needed to go. She wasn’t necessarily welcome at my uncle Marcel’s, because my aunt, Simone, who was the wife of Marcel, did not see her presence with a lot of pleasure. But at our house she was always welcome, though my father said -- always tried to make fun of her, for one reason or another, but nicely. But still, she didn’t have a room of her own. She slept in the living room, on a bed that was a kind of divan. But she was of the utmost discretion and very, very nice. And, so, one day it was decided by the brothers and the sister, my mother in this case, that she should have her own place, her own location, so we had acquired a little bungalow for her at the beach at Ain El Turk where she could live. But truth be told, she was rather solitary until the moment when her sister – I forget her name right now – Yes! She had married a man who was called Mr. Delorme, her sister – Fifine – we called her Fifine – which means that her name was Josephine. She also came and rented a bungalow very near my grandmother, you could walk there, and so there she did not feel unhappy, she did not feel alone. So, in her house during the summer vacation, it happened that we went to spend some time at my grandmother’s, with my mother – that was later. Before there was the bungalow, it happened to us to camp, in order to have access to those beaches. And one year we camped at Trouville, again with my uncle and cousin Suzette and my aunt Morissette. Morissette was the wife of my uncle René. And so, that’s what we did. And we adored those vacations, it was very enjoyable and fun. Everyone seemed to have a good time, as much the adults as the children.

CF: Where did you go to high school?

OF: I went to the high school of Oran starting at age 10 until 17-18 years old. It was a beautiful high school, very elegant, but to get there I had to go on foot, from my house to the school, which entailed at least a half hour of walking. In the morning and to come back at night. And even often to go home for lunch, because at that time we did not eat at school. We needed to eat lunch at home. And there was at least two hours between noon and 2PM, which was when we returned home. So, we went home and went back to school until about 4PM. So that’s roughly it, I very much liked that school, I was very interested and enjoyed myself, but at first, I wasn’t well. I had to repeat a class, I was too young. Initially they made me skip a class, I was young by about a year, because I was born in January, and didn’t feel very comfortable among my classmates because I felt younger. There’s no doubt. And after having repeated that year, which was the third year of school, suddenly everything felt easy and good. It was a very good idea to repeat the class.

CF: How old were you?

OF: Thirteen years old.

CF: Did you walk with your sister?

OF: No, my sister did not go to the same school. She went to a school which focused on the first part of the secondary education. I had very little daily interaction with my sister because she went her way – her school being at a whole different location – and I went the other. But before that we were both in an elementary school called L’Ecole Berthelot. She was two and a half years younger than me, so she was much younger in a sense. We walked to school either alone or with friends who lived near us. But I don’t remember having friends who were habitual to walk with. The idea was each person was in charge of arriving at school at the right hour, so we left home at the needed hour to get to school.

CF: Was Claudie’s school a technical school?

OF: No not at all. It was a school where they taught the same things as the high school, but they didn’t teach Latin and Greek. They were more modern studies. You could learn English or Spanish. The living languages. They didn’t teach the dead languages.

CF: And your favorite subject?

OF: I always liked very, very much what they called “French” where you had to write compositions, essays, and I remember very well at the time when I repeated the class that it’s then that I began to really like writing my papers. I remember the first essay that I gave to that teacher in that French class of the year that I was repeating – she returned my essay saying: “Mademoiselle (Miss) Piovanacci next time you will not let your parents help you. Evidently, you didn’t write this, you let yourself be helped.” And that was absolutely not true. I had written it all by myself. And I must have tried to persuade this lady that it was not the case. But she did not believe me. So, I saw that what I wrote must not have been too bad. And I was very happy.

CF: You were how old?

OF: Well, thirteen years old.

CF: So, after high school you succeeded at your Bac (Baccalaureate).

OF: I passed my Bac in the two successive years, the first part of the Bac and the second part of the Bac.

CF: It was in philo? (Philosophy)

OF: Philo yes.

CF: So, when it was done, you heard that you had passed?

OF: Of course, I was very happy.

CF: So, then you left right away to a university?

OF: No, I went right away to an art school in Paris. Because I thought I wanted to do art. Truth be told I was very conflicted, I had several desires, I didn’t know what to choose. I left for this school where I wasn’t at all happy because it was rather a school that was frequented by people of high society, that didn’t really need to work. Who did this because young girls needed to know how to draw, that was one of the things they did. But I did still learn a lot of things: to use watercolors, drawing, to do interesting things, but I didn’t necessarily like it a lot.

CF: After that?

OF: After that I decided I should leave that school and present an exam to teach drawing in the high schools. One prepared for this exam in two ways: either entering a special school to prepare or doing it in a personal way by taking courses in the city of Paris, also at the Beaux Arts. I chose the second thread, and I did what was needed to do. And I took the exam the first year and passed the written portion, meaning the drawing. And then we presented the oral portion, and I didn’t pass the oral part. But it was a difficult exam, only few people passed. And the fact that I had been received to the first part was already enough to indicate that you had a chance. So, I decided to do a second year to try to pass it all. Unfortunately, I did not pass either portion. At that point I said to myself, what am I going to do? I had met your father and accepted to marry him. So, I went back to Algeria. I decided to present an exam in literature at the university and I prepared it a little bit at Madeleine’s (Jean’s sister) who lived in the Algers area, and I passed that exam. Which gave me the possibility to continue at the university. But we left with Papa, it was at that moment that we decided to go show the movie that Papa had brought back from his trip [across the Atlantic]. And we made trips to youth hostels in Algeria before going back to France to prepare to go to the United States.

CF: And Mamilou and Papilou (her parents) were still in Oran?

OF: Of course…

CF: But you were in Algers because it’s there…

OF: It’s there that I presented the exams. One had to go to the university of Algers to present those exams. And there was a program of history, of Latin, of French and so I put myself to redo those things that I had abandoned, and I was very happy. It pleased me a lot and I found it very interesting.

CF: Was that different, did people often spend time in Paris and then return to Algeria?

OF: No, I did things that were not done in the sense that I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do and so I did many things to see. And when I presented the exam of drawing for example there was a testof art history. And I had prepared my art history and it interested me prodigiously. And the grade that I had in art history was 15 over 20. It was a very high grade. It showed that I had very, very well succeeded. On the other hand, I was very bad in what they called perspective, which was a study that needed to be done in a school that I had gone to, in a parallel fashion, to the Ecole des Beaux Arts, to learn to draw within the rules of perspective. And it pleased me absolutely not and I was very bad in perspective and so I got a very bad grade. But even with that bad grade I had been received. So, it indicated that there were things that were good, and others that weren’t.

CF: And during all that time did you have English courses?

OF: …Yes, I did take English courses in high school.

CF: What kind of phrases…?

OF: English bothered me prodigiously because we always had rather bizarre teachers. A teacher Mademoiselle Martinet [word for a punitive device, whip]. She was a woman very, very intelligent, she herself had a doctorate in English but she was very bizarre. It was she who would address me when I entered the class, instead of calling me Odette Piovanacci, she would say, “Mademoiselle Panovachi!” On purpose she would mistake me with another student who was Italian. And since the Corsicans did not like the Italians -- it was said in my family – she would on purpose say “Mademoiselle Pavonachi, you are Italian, correct?” So, I would say: “But no, Madame, I am not, I am of Corsican origin.” “Oh, so it’s you the Corsican? And you Mademoiselle Vanterulli?” That was the other one. “You are Corsican?” “No, Mademoiselle, I am of Italian origin.” “Oh, yes I’m getting the two of you mixed up.” She purposefully tried to bother us on this subject. And when she read a passage from Moliere where it says: “Oh, thief. Oh, thief!” she did it with such intensity that the school janitor arrived in the room saying, “What is going on, Mademoiselle? Do you have a problem?” And that made us laugh, and we spent our time laughing during these English classes, instead of learning.

CF: Moliere for English? To translate…?

OF: Yes, it was to translate, maybe, it was a translation. I remember that instance among others because there were many things…

CF: What kinds of English phrases?

OF: Our instruction tried to make you speak, it was very book-oriented, everything happened with books. So, we translated, we read, from French to English, and especially they tried to make us pronounce the words in a good way, using phonetics. For example, she screamed: (25:15) “Owwww Kowww.” (Much laughter from Odette and Catherine.) It was terrible. And the whole class repeated “Owwww Kowww!” And for the other sounds it was similar.

CF: Oh, I see.

OF: It was very annoying, very annoying. I was absolutely not gifted for English, and I detested the English language. It absolutely did not please me.

CF: At that time did you imagine coming to America?

OF: No, I did not imagine it at all, but when the Americans arrived in Algeria since the Americans arrived in Algeria to help the French during World War 2 -- they were funny, they were, how can I say? different, and that added a sort of luster to that English language, which pretty much became the American language. And with the Girl Scouts we did an end of the year party and it so happened that we represented an American male soldier and a female American soldier. Because there were women too who came, and I represented an American woman and one of my friends represented an American male soldier. And we tried to speak in the English language, and we cracked up, we made everyone laugh because we did it poorly, or with humor. And so.

CF: When you came to America did you have different jobs?

OF: When I came to America, the first time we arrived, we arrived in New York. Papa told me if you want to learn English and speak it, you need to work. That will be the best way to fit into this society. So, we looked in the New York Times, the little ads, at the time you found little ads with job offers, and we saw a little listing that said they were looking for people for what was called “lettering”. And I said, I can design letters, there is no doubt. I had learned really, in a very precise manner to design the letters with a compass and ruler, and it was perfect. So, I go to this appointment to see what kind of work it would be. And I was greeted by a woman in a large office and this woman was speaking to me in English and I hardly understood what she was saying. I believe I understood she was talking of cadavers. No, of skeletons. And she was speaking of letters that had to do with skeletons. I didn’t understand, but anyway I had been told to, above all, not say no -- you can do everything. I said, “Yes, yes, yes.” (In English.) “Yes, I can, I can, I can.” So, finally she hired me and said to come the next day or the day after, I don’t remember. I came and indeed it entailed -- it was a company that prepared skeletons for students in medical school, where on the parts of the body was marked the name of the bones, the muscles, the nerves. And all of this was written generally in Latin. So, it was very fun because I recognized a lot of things and I could write. And there I found myself with very diverse groups of black people, white people, who were very nice with me, and who tried to help me, in my language. And little by little I felt part of a group, interesting and interested.

CF: Can you give a list of all the kinds of work you did before taking your job at UCSD. [University of California, San Diego]

OF: When we left New York we went down to Maryland because there was a factory where Papa was going to build his boat. And there I found myself in a little town, tiny, which was called Havre de Grace and where there wasn’t a lot to do. But I liked a lot of things …Another of my ideas in my life was to take care of children, in nursery schools…it interested me enormously. I liked singing, I liked young children, and so I tried to find a job in a nursery school. And by luck the woman who rented the apartment below in the house we had decided to rent was a woman, a librarian on what was called the Aberdeen Proving Ground. It was a place where there were some armies, soldiers who were preparing during these years. What is it called when people are…? the years when they are recruited. Because at that time there was the conscription. You had to be a soldier from a certain date to a certain date. That lady said, I am going to help you. If it interests you to be in a nursery school I am going to help you. And we looked and there were some offers, some possibilities to be a teacher in a nursery school. And she would take me, and it was she who would speak for me. “Yes, yes, this lady can do this, can do that.” And they hired me. So, I became nursery schoolteacher.

[Sound of four chimes for 4pm from grandfather clock which was brought from Jean’s parents’ home in Guéret, France.]

It was great, I had an assistant, it was a lady who was older than me who spoke the language of course since she was American, and I didn’t speak it, but I learned a lot and had a lot of fun.

CF: That’s nice and after that?

OF: To be better suited to be a good nursery schoolteacher I went to the University of Johns Hopkins to get a certificate. I took courses and prepared a kind of certificate for nursery school, and I succeeded with that. They came to my nursery school and inspected me. There was a female inspector who came and found that what was happening was nice and good and they gave me the license for this nursery school with me as the teacher.

CF: Was it in English these courses?

OF: Of course. It was in English. And at the same time, I continued to draw, and I did exhibits with certain things I made. And there were many people who helped us, in particular the Holdens, to do that and also there were some people very connected who were called the Camerons who had a house who were very rich and also in a kind of East-Coast class of society. They were connected by family ties to Dos Passos, the writer. And that’s where we met Dos Passos in the midst of a party where we were invited. And it was really the South, with the houses with arches, you know, with the white columns in front, and the garden in the back where they drank the cocktails. And Mr. Dos Passos was having himself served cocktails, gin and tonics. One would have believed to be in “Gone with The Wind”. For us it was a kind of make-believe as if it couldn’t be real. I also taught a course to people that this woman had gathered, a course in art history that I invented, because, of course, I had to speak of things that interested these people. I had a lot of fun because I designed this class. The people were interested since they came. I enjoyed it very, very much.

CF: And after you found yourself in San Diego…

OF: After when I found myself in San Diego, I tried to find work because of course there was Francis who was here [oldest child]. I right away tried to ask for an equivalent diploma and I looked for work and found it at The Bishop’s School, thanks to Mrs. Helen Raitt who was a guarantor for me. She would tell people I would do whatever they expected of me, and she recommended me. I was happy to be recommended though this woman had never seen me teach or anything else. But I was very happy at The Bishop’s School. There were not many students…

CF: Was it only girls…?

OF: It was only girls at that time. It was good, it worked well.

CF: And then after, how did it work with UCSD?

OF: With UCSD it so happened that the university was being founded, was opening, and there was a Department of Linguistics. And the person in charge was Mr. Newmark. And he had conceived of a program where one would teach the students the foreign language in the actual foreign language. Without speaking absolutely any English. He needed for that what was called “tutors” – meaning people that presented the courses in the language, so I presented myself and I was hired as a tutor. And the idea was there were these kinds of dialogues that we taught the students that the students needed to understand and speak. And, in fact, we wrote these dialogues for Mr. Newmark. Mr. Newmark was very happy with my services. And I did somewhat what I wanted in that department because he was very delighted with what I did. And after when I had had enough of doing that work because it became a bit repetitive, I met with the Department of Literature, and I said I could do the course for the students in the first year. And they hired me as lecturer. And I very much enjoyed doing that. And when I started to get a bit bored with that, I supervised those courses which were taught by other people. I prepared the courses, the exams, and didn’t teach anymore. And then I stopped because Papa had a small stroke. And he became very dependent of me. He had been very shocked, deep inside, and I had to take care of Jean essentially and I couldn’t prepare my courses. I stopped brusquely.

CF: When was the last time you went to Algeria?

OF: The last time I went to Algeria was in 1958 because Francis was born, and he was 18 months old, and I wanted to introduce him to my parents and Jean’s parents. And Jean had some things to do on the boat that was already in Florida, where we were preparing to leave for our trip around the world. I was going to see my parents to basically introduce my son and at the same time say a little goodbye because we were going to leave the locations where we could see each other. So, I left for Algeria in Autumn. I don’t remember if I went first to Guéret or first to Algérie. He was still a baby… When I arrived in Algeria, I received a phone call from your father, totally crazy and saddened, he told me: they had put the locks/chains on the boat, made him leave the boat, and told him that he had stolen the boat, in short, that did not belong to him, but was Mr. Cournand’s. And he didn’t know what he was going to do. And he couldn’t send me money because he didn’t have any. And for the moment I should manage as I could with my parents and his parents. And we would decide what we would do. And that shocked me a lot and I decided to go work in Oran at what I could do. I went to the secondary school of Oran where my sister was teaching. I asked to see the directress. She received me and I explained that I could teach English if they needed it and they took me as a substitute. I taught English until I left Algeria and went back up towards France to return to America. Jean and I had discussed by phone and letter that I would go to California because we chose to come to California so that Jean could pursue studies in oceanography at Scripps Institute in La Jolla. And that’s where I arrived with Francis, who was two since August, I arrived in September or October to La Jolla, where Papa had rented an apartment in Pacific Beach, just a street away from the ocean. I found that place so beautiful and so interesting and idyllic that I fell in love with that place right away and we decided to stay there.

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